Had my Appoitment with my DR last night

[nomore]

Hi everyone,

We had my appointment with my DR last night. I am pleased to report it went very well. I was nervous about things, as we termnated this past fall due to HG, with him as the DR.

We talked about my accupunture, taking milk thistle, dandeloin root and importantly the fact that I had a LOT of anxiety, depression this last time that I didnt know know how to deal with. We also talked about differenet meds that we have never tried (visatirl, kyrtil, anzement, tigan, etc). He is on board with giving some things a shot. BTW, he was definetly OK with the visatril, even though I know there was a debate about its safety once on here. It is a class c drug, but so is compazine (stemtil), and phenergan. Visatril also addresses some anxiety issues in addition to being an antiemetic. We also talked about the p;ossible need for antidepresants and how my Mom was going to move in with us.

My Peri is so great. I am still glad he is my DR. My Dh asked him how bad my case was in comparion to what he has seen. GO FIGURE he says my case of HG is about the worst he ever saw. Only worse case was 30 years ago when he was a resident and had a patient who was 20 weeks along and in renal (kidney failure) due to HG, at which that time they had to termniate the pregnancy.

We also promised that we wouldnt terminate again, however, he added the note that he would require me to do so IF he felt my life was at danger, which apparently he feels could be a risk (Swell feeling ya know?).

Overall, we are on a good track. A SCARY track, but good one. Now, just got to get over my fear again, which got WAY stronger after the appoitment!

Robin

[***]

HUGS

I'm there with you on the fear, that in itself can be debilitating at times. I too have the same doc as I had when we term. in Jan. 04. The doc I go to is a group practice and my doc put a not in my file that we are NOT going to be passive with treatment this time. I had my appointment at the beginning of March (had my IUD taken out). Then we saw the peri the 17th of this month and he gave me a script for vistaril to take after I ovulate once a day and then if I get pg to take every four to six hours. Hoping that maybe the hg won't be as bad. We are all set up with the respiratory and infusion nurses (homecare) if needed.
Now we just have to get over the fear and try again.
Best of luck to you and hope to see you in the Pregnant group soon.

ANxious right along with you

[Natalie]

Hiya Robin

I'm so glad that your Dr. appt went well. I was going to suggest that you maybe send a pm to a few of the ladies on here that have had just about the worse case of HG you can get (e.g. danimomof2girls) and ask them what they did / tried and any tips they may have that might help you. I only had a moderate case so I think any tips I give will be of limited value in a case such as yours.

Also, did the Dr. say anything to you about NG feeding or PICC lines? Sorry if you have covered that before elsewhere on the forum.

With any 'luck', there will be a few of us all being very sick at the same time so we can support each other. I know that I can't read when ill so I won't be online very much but I am going to get my dh to post for me and I'll be writing to you to try to encourage you along.

Take care and good luck ttc

Love Natalie, xx

[Marie]

Robin,

That is great news!!! I am so glad that you are receiving the support that you desired from your physician. I know you have been preparing for some time now. What do you have left on your ttc protocol?

Best Wishes,
Marie

[nomore]

Hi Natalie & eveyone else!

Thanks for the replies! I will post my protocol soon (Im on my laptop, and its on my other computer). In response to the PICC, NG tube question. I had a PICC in both of my pervoius pregnancies. In my 1st, it got put in at 12 weeks and was there until 2 days post partum. In the 2nd pregnacy, it got put in when I was 6 weeks and removed 2 days post termination.

HG for me has been on the more severe side. Trust me when I say I WISH it wasnt! Hosptial stays, home nurse care, 24 hour IVs until I was 24 weeks along with Madison, still trhowing massive keytones with the Hydration therapy.... isnt it all so fun? NOT!

Anyways, Im not trying to be too hopeful it will be better this time, although we have done a lot of Prep work for me physically and planning for our family.

I go back to the Peri in late April for a gyn exam, to ensure there wasnt any trauma from the D &C. I am praying that we make it through this next pregnancy. I dont even have dreams of wanting more kids than 2 anymore. I KNOW i CANT do this for a 3rd baby. 1 More baby, thats it (unless its mutplies!).

It just gets so hard to think about sometimes. I think it was Emily who hit the nail right on the head that its differernt to get prego when you know you will get HG. The 1st time you didnt know the misery existed, how it would be, how long it would last, etc. The 2nd time, its like signing your self up for it, knowing the consquences and difficulites it will put on yourself and your loved ones. Somehow, to me, it did feel different.

So, heres to getting the courage to tackle HG again!

Robin

[bibliojo]

Hello Robin,

I'm glad to hear that your appt went well last night -- sounds like you have a few more options available to you yet. Good! Sorry to hear though that the doctor thinks your the worst case he's seen in 30 years -- that is not a diagnosis any HGer wants! You have my sympathies.

Right there with you (and everybody else) with the fear thing. Ack, we're less than 2 months away?!! I sometimes wish I could be all prepared mentally and physically and then get pregnant accidently - now, like that's possible!

Hugs,
Joanna

[Kadinga]

Hi Robin,

First, I'd like to add my congrats to everyone else's on a relatively positive doctor's appointment. At least you know that he is taking you seriously and that you won't have to fight to convince him that you need extra care!

Secondly, while I'm totally agreeing with you on the idea that getting pregnant knowing that you'll have HG is a lot scarier than getting pregnant with no expectations, there's another perspective that I'm clinging to and which might help.
When we "go back", we are not going to be hit by an unexpected freight train that leaves us reeling in shock. We will know what it is, what needs to be done, and how much we will love our baby at the end of it.
We will not be hibernating alone in our bedrooms wondering what this is and why we can't just "have cracker and get over it". We will know that there are many, many other women out there who feel our pain, AND our families will also know what's going on and be ready to help.
We will not be completely dehydrated before we are given IV fluids, because we will see it coming! (Have you got a pack of the sticks to test for keytones at home?) We know whether or not water aggravates us, we know to drink something else if it does, we know to try stuff like ice chips (have you got an icecrusher or similar gadget?)
We know that it won't kill us because we are fortunate enough to live in an age where that doesn't need to happen. (roll on, 21st century!)

Now, all of that said, I wasn't as sick as you and I don't want you to feel like I'm trivialising your fears which must be stronger than mine. Fear is terrible thing to feel, but if it makes us prepared then it makes us stronger. Strong enough? Well, that's the question of the millenium that only gets answered after you've taken the plunge. I wish you all the absolute best that could possibly come your way. Your angel in heaven was just too beautiful for this earth. Give that first child an extra hug tonight. She was worth it. The next one will be, too.

good luck

Amanda
Mum to Heather - b 9/15/2003
Planning to ttc in May

[nomore]

Amanda,

Thank you for your opinions, although I have to say, having already had a 2nd pregnancy, and being in a different spot than you, I DO feel differntly than you. Yes, knowing what to excpect is better than being blind sided, but making a concoius choice to put youself, your significant other and your child through that is a totally different ball game to me.

I do understand where you are coming from, but having had severe HG twice and having to alrady have made the horrific choice to terminate my much wanted 2nd pregnancy, due to the fact we could not get any of the meds to help at a signifcant level, was still dehydarted on 24 hour hydration at home and lost over 20 pounds in a 3 week time frame, I feel my fear MAY be a tad stronder than yours

Good luck as your continue to prepare.

Robin

[teddi]

Robin,

It looks like you have really done your work!! You have quite a protocol there!!!

I forget, did you do steroids w/your first pregnancy?

I'm curious about your experience w/TPN. I didn't have it w/my 1st (even though I dropped at my lowest to 92 lbs and hovered around 95 for a while) or even a PICC. I had a PICC w/my last pregnancy, which was a definately a help but only for fluids (and I added vitamins too), not TPN. Also, I agree with you about the non-continuous hydration. I did 1 -2 liters most days, and that helped. I found it most useful to do at night (when someone is home, also helps to get a good night sleep. I always felt better when I actually slept thru the night) OR during the day if I was in a bad vomiting cycle. It helps to get that boost- I used D5LRs, and I think the sugar helped too.

Anyway, about the TPN, what criteria did you Dr use to decide to use or not use it? I'm sorry, but 2 lbs is just a completely inadequate wt gain especially carrying twins, and I wonder if my girls could have had better birthweights if I did TPN (my son too for that matter). I told one of my Peri's that I managed on most days about 500 calories, on good days maybe 1000. I almost asked about TPN, but didn't, which I regret now. By the time I was managed by the peri's (after 20 wks) my wt loss had finally stopped, and I was slowing regaining what I lost. I guess they thought I was better than I was. However, I really think my wt was only stable because I continued w/the fluids. Still, I wonder if actual FOOD & calorie intake should be a main factor in deciding to use TPN ?? Or just wt loss?? Also I developed HELLP which has been linked to malnutrition.

So, I'm wondering if it'd be useful to do a protocol of my own- umm, not TTC anytime soon, maybe never, but Suzanne's news got me to thinking, that as we aren't sterile- we could always have an oops too (plus I don't use hormonal bc of any kind, we use NFP & condoms).

One thing I did do that helped me was to eat ALOT. I actually gained 6 lbs in the two cycles we were TTC & before the HG hit. I ate ate ate (plus I knew it might be the last chance I'd have for a while!!!!). Do you think a wt gain might help you? I had been @ 128- 129, not overwt for me, pretty much around my ideal wt w/just a little chubbiness, but I think the wt gain helped me the first two weeks- just that extra cushion of fat & water helped keep the morning sickness "normal" longer than w/my first preg.

I know you are scared- exactly a year ago we were TTC. April's cycle in fact, wow. It seemed like time went by soooo slow while I was pregnant, but really, I can't believe it's been a year! I hope in a year from now you feel exactly the same way. You know we'll be here for you. You got a little quiet during your last pregnancy- keep us posted, ok? Even if you have nothing to say other than how miserable you are, we want to help you if we can. Fingers crossed for you w/TTC!!!

[nomore]

Hi Teddi,

I cant believe another year has gone by too!!! About the TPN, I didnt ask to go on it.. lol, BUT the Peri (my DR now) who I 1st saw when I was 12 weeks prego with Madison decided my weight loss was just too much, and I was still unable to keep ANY food down. In fact, I think in the 7 days prior I had managed to eat 1 VERY small piece of watermelon. That was it!!! I was already on 24 hour hydration (and had been since I was 7 weeks along). I was literally starving myself to death (not on purpose of corse!). I was down to 136 pounds I think. I am almost 5 ft 8 and meduim boned. Had I not been prego, thats about a size 3 to 4 on me. When I got prego I was around an 8. Anyways, I looked like walking bones with skin! My Dr told me that if I couldnt keep ANY food down, the baby was going to start to suffer after 12 weeks, as my fat reseves were pretty much depleted. TPN did its purpose. It kept Madison and I alive. Of course, it also blew my gallbladder to pieces! I had a bad reaction to the lipids (I think now, looking back, I had GB problems even before pregnancy). Anyways, I started having GB attacks of intense vomiting and pain until they FINALLY belived me that the TPN made me feel worse when I ended up being hospitalized again at 17 weeks due to GB, when they finally told me it was the GB!

So, then I went on lipid free TPN, which doesnt pack on the pounds as good, but still gives you calroies. I was 24 weeks when I finally hit my pre-preg weight (ONLY due to the TPN mid you). Thats when they took me off it, as I was able to at least keep a minor amount of food down- maybe 500 to 1000 calories. Some weeks I lost after that, but was 10 pounds gained at 38 weeks and then got pre-e and gained another 12 in water in 1 week! (Mind you, I was VERY nausated again and wasnt eating much, so I KNEW it was water!).

The TPN was good, but miserable in the sense I had to be hooked up to it like 16 hours a day. And then I was supposed to do hydration on top of that. You know, you sort of get SICK of being hooked up 24/7 for 16 to 17 weeks. But, it did keep is alive, and that it did well!

I chuckled when you siad I didnt post much this last fall when I was pregnant!!!! Your right. It wasnt out of NOT wanting to, but it was out of shear inability to get to my computer. I could barely make to the couch in the living room, let alone go down a flight of stairs to our family room to go online. So, I will add that we now have a wireless laptop, so I can go online to my hearts content from my bed if I wanted to! I think this will make it A LOT easier to get the support I need from here.

Alas, somedays I get more scared then otehrs. And I know so many pregnant people right now. If I hear one more person say I have the worst morning sickness I think I might scream!!!! (These are people who didnt know me when I was pregnant with Madison, and dont know why I suddenly "got busy" this fall.

So, I have rambled on and on here!!! I do think its a good thing to be prepared just in case. After Madison and before our 2nd pregnancy we did NFP and condoms. We also used NFP for about 9 months before we concived Madison (with both pregnancies we got pregnant our 1st month). I am debating on what to do about BC after this next pregnancy. I am undecided between an IUD and hubby getting the big V. I dont think we want anymore kids than 2 (unless we got blessed with twins). I dont think I am capable of doing this more than 1 more time. And, hubby only ever wanted 2 to begin with!!!!! So, well see!

Robin.... who is trying her best to be brave, but feeling QUITE scared!

[nomore]

OOps.. I forgot to add I did do steroids in my 2nd pregancy. We started them when I was about 8 weeks along. I was doing 60 mgs IV solumedrol a day. They did not offer any significant improvement sadly Although, they did slow the weight loss slighty, but I still was unable to eat/drink.

In fact, for about 3 months everytime that thread titled something like another amazing steroid story popped up, I got SO annoyed they didnt do anything for me!!!!! However, I have read that some people have better luck when they try them after 12 weeks. We will try them again, if neccesary, but I still dont want to try them until I am 12 weeks or further.

Heres to hoping the accupunture, body detox and NAET allergy treatments are going to make pregnancy at least SOMEWHAT better than before

Robin

[aaronsmommy]

Reading this stuff about the TPN reminded me - have you tried an NG tube (or probably an NJ tube if you are still vomiting a lot when you try it). I know it sounds horrible, but it really is successful for some. I must say it was a miserable experience for me, but I was glad I tried it once. If you are like me and never get to the point you can eat, you do need to have at least some lipids because of the essential fatty acids. I really think TPN made me feel worse even though it was essential and that somehow getting food in my intestines may have made me feel a bit better. If I were ever to get pg again, I wouldn't do TPN again - I'm sure I would need nutrition so I would get a g-tube (or g-j-tube). I didn't like the idea of a trip to the OR last time, but I really think it would have been worth it. I've never met anyone who has gotten one for hg, but it sounds like a good idea. It is so much better nutrition to do it through the gut, and you could even still take your herbal treatments that way - just straight in to the tube.

Certainly hoping you wouldn't need it.

[teddi]

Thanks for the TPN info. I didn't know about the lipid thing...I'm glad you mentioned it, because the CT scan I had right after my C section showed (supposedly, I'm still waiting to get the actual report) something about me having a fatty liver. SOOO, i researched it a bit and it was probably directly due to the HG (I have no other risk factors), and the HELLP thing could all be interelated. I'm really really glad you mentioned it. If I take the plunge again, I DON'T want one tiny hint of HELLP- A) because it's dangerous to me & baby and B) Unless it develops during labor, you can almost count on a C Section.

Does TPN HAVE to take that long? I have no familiarity w/it. It is unlike the IV liter bags?

With my first I did take Prednisone. It was no magic cure for me. Don't get me wrong they did help me gain about 3 lbs in one week. I was OBSESSED with food. I dreamt food, ate food, while eating breakfast thought about what I'd eat for my snack afterwards, lol. But, I still puked alot (if someone didn't know me, they'd think I went from being anorexic to bulemic!!!). In fact one challenge was getting the pills to stay down. The bad thing though was that I had bad mental reactions. I became *SUPER*bitch. After several weeks it was bad depression & suicidal thoughts (not that I was serious about it, but still). I didn't want to do them last time unless things were spiraling out of control. Plus I felt like what it supposedly feels like when you take speed- I would be awake all night. Yucky stuff.

I'm not even TTC and this stuff is stressful to think about!

[teddi]

What's the diff between an NG tube and an NJ tube?

I'm not sure how it's supposed to help, I've always wondered about this. Food in the stomach is food in the stomach right? Why would you NOT vomit if you had the NG tube and were still really nauseated? When my girls had their NG tubes in, they did still regurgitate their feedings (maybe less than via bottle I guess).

[teddi]

Ok, one more question- if you do TPN, please tell me that your liver & kidney functions get checked on frequently???

If you do NG feeding, do you deal w/constipation or the opposite?

[aaronsmommy]

the G is for gastric - tube ends in the stomach, j for jejunum, ends in the small intestines, so the food can't get thrown up (and the tube either). I think with zofran it would be a constant battle against constipation, but you can put whatever medications you need to loosen things up directly in to the tube, so you should be able to deal with it okay.
I tried running TPN for 12 hours a day with my first, but my blood sugar would drop coming off of it, but they always kept trying to get it to run that way.

[emily]

I hadn't checked this thread out for a while but it is a great thread! Very informational. Are you doing NAET for horomones? We should do a thread on that. I know very little about it other than my mom used it to successful treat SEVERE food allergies that she had for years.

[HGx3]

rOBIN,

tHAT IS GREAT NEWS! YOU HAVE REALLY THOUGHT THINGS THROUGH AND PLANNED WELL. DONT PUT TOO MUCH FAITH IN THE OTHER MEDS THOUGH. kYTRIL IS A LOT LIKE ZOFRAN, AND THOUGH VISTARIL HELPS JUST A TAD WITH THE NAUSEA, IT DOESNT HELP MUCH....hOWEVER, IT DID WONDERS FOR THE ADDITIONAL ANXIETY I EXPERIENCED FROM THE REGLAN.

I ALSO WAS ON AN ANTIDEPRESSANT, EFFEXOR. yOU MAY WANT TO EVEN CONSIDER STARTING ON IT NOW SINCE IT TAKES A GOOD 30 DAYS TO GET IN YOUR SYSTEM. yOU MAY FIND YOURSELF REALLY DEPRESSED AS YOUR DUE DATE FROM PG 2 ROLLS AROUND, AND IF YOU ARE ALREADY PG BY THEN WITH HG KIBKIN IT, YOU MAY BE ABLE TO AVOID AN AWFUL LOW.

OH, BYW....I JUST READ AN ARTICLE ON HONEY YESTERDAY, THAT SUGGESTS THAT IT CAN AID NAUSEA, MAYBE YOU CAN BE THE GUIENEA PIG, LOL I HOPE YOUR EFFORTS PAY OFF, I AM ANXIOUS TO SEE IF THE ACCUPUNCTURE WILL MAKE A DIFFERECE FOR YOU!!!!

LOTS OF HUGS AND BEBE VIBES!

SORRY 4 THE ALL CAPS....U

[MamaLily]

I just wanted to chime in for a minute about the tube. I guess mine must have been an NJ tube because it went past my stomach into my intestine. So, every drop of nutrition that went in stayed down! It was great to be completely nurished without putting anything in my mouth or stomach.

Also, constipation wasn't too much of a problem for me - and I've had the feeding tube in 2 pregnancies now. The formula I was given had fiber in it, which must have helped. Things were a little slow moving along, but I was able to have a bowel movement at least once every day - even when I was taking 32 mgs of Zofran.

If you can get over the discomfort of having the tube inserted, this is a GREAT option! A few hours of discomfort is definitely worth the result, at least for me!

- Anna

[nomore]

Teddi-

Yes, your liver functions get checked frequently- at least once a week, sometimes more. So, having the PICC makes that a little more bearable.

I think TPN can go in over a 12 hour period (and I think thats the quickest it can go in, although I am not positive). I didnt react well when the TPN went in quicker.. I felt more nausated. In fact, I hated the way I felt when the TPN went it... the smell of it REPULSED me.... of course, what smell really didnt! It just looked gross to me, but it did nourish us!!!!

Aimee-

I didnt know an NJ tube existed!!! I have been prevoiusly aainst NG tubes for myself, as the vomiting is to profuse and I am TERRIFIED it wouldnt stay down. I have seen people throw these up in the ER and its not a pretty site! NJ tube will defiently be a question to ask the DR about at my next visit!

All- Thanks for all of the other thoughts! I will mention the depression/anxiety thing again at my next visit with my DR, and inquire how long it will take to be effeective and also remind him again of what would of been my future due date and my anxiety over this.

Emily- we can start an NAET thread. I will post all of my "knowledge" on that there.. lol

Thanks all,

Robin